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Tulpa Discussion / tulpa-discussion
The channel for discussion strictly on the topic of tulpas. Take off-topic discussion to #lounge Forum's Tulpa Discussion Board: https://community.tulpa.info/forum/4-general-discussion/
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Deleted User 4/6/2018 1:10 AM
Hey that isn't tulpa related! B&
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Hug/pet your tulpa.
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Snuggle Squiggle 4/6/2018 2:33 AM
Amalgam is surrounded by dignified tulpas she can’t pet
2:33 AM
Send help.
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Kronkle[Alyson] 4/6/2018 2:33 AM
delet this
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make a tulpa which isn't dignified
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Snuggle Squiggle 4/6/2018 2:35 AM
Nah, it’s already ever so slightly crowded over here. I’m pretty sure half of us would immediately veto any plan that included “make another tulpa” as a step.
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small systems ✔
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get a cat?
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there's really nothing in life that requires creating another human being in your brain
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oh yeah? how about being a top tier pathetic loser?
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still doesn't require it
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that's fair
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Stelliferous 4/6/2018 2:40 AM
{{How about traumagenic formation, for something requiring creating another person in your brain, @Felight? We can drop that if it's too Tumblr syscourse-y though. Lots of toxic there...}}
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okay please don't do tags at me without a name
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...what?
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Snuggle Squiggle 4/6/2018 2:41 AM
They’re asking about trauma-induced multiplicity, I think. (edited)
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And DID isn't the same thing as intentionally making another systemmate
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You have to be dysfunctional to have DID
2:42 AM
And be unable to function like a normal healthy human
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Trauma-induced multiplicity isn't something requiring deliberate creation of another mind.
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Hence Disorder at the end
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Snuggle Squiggle 4/6/2018 2:42 AM
There’s something to be said for not basing your exercise of free time on what is and isn’t “necessary.”
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while my system wanted to make me because they thought I could possibly help solve their issues, they absolutely did not need to make me
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It is a term used for a group of multiples that resulted from trauma.
2:43 AM
You can use semantics to argue the point, but it certainly is ignoring the spirit of the initial statement.
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Idk why it's even relevant, we're talking about people making tulpas, not forming alters through trauma
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Also a good point.
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should I cancel my order of whips and lego blocks?
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Tulpas shouldn't be made just cause, they should have a valid reason, and people should be highly conservative with the speed and extent their systems grow
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Snuggle Squiggle 4/6/2018 2:45 AM
(Aside: I disike it when people cast misunderstanding language as “semantics.” Semantics is about what language means. Words have meanings, and context and connatation is a part of that meaning.)
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...hence why one can use semantics to argue a point.
2:46 AM
In any case.
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Snuggle Squiggle 4/6/2018 2:54 AM
I think it’s entirely valid to make a tulpa “just cause” as long as the the system has the time to care for them.
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I think it's universally good to make a tulpa if you have interest in it
2:55 AM
no matter what ends up happening, so long as that result isn't crippling mental illness
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Snuggle Squiggle 4/6/2018 2:55 AM
I wouldn’t go that far.
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I disagree strongly with that.
2:56 AM
I think it is generally good as long as there is genuine respectful and caring treatment of the tulpa.
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freedom nets benefit, people do what's right if you let them act by their instincts.
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Snuggle Squiggle 4/6/2018 2:56 AM
I don’t necessarily think creation of a sentient life is a net positive, or even a net neutral. But it’s a matter of not dictating what people can and cannot do inside their minds. (edited)
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Morality and responsibility.
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...I believe the children putting forks into electrical sockets may have something to say to you about that, Reguile.
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Snuggle Squiggle 4/6/2018 2:58 AM
There is zero reason to believe people, left to their instincts, act in the best interests for the collective 7+ billion of us. (edited)
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I think that goes to show that having electrical sockets is way more beneficial than those couple of children
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...and I believe that the point was just missed there.
2:59 AM
People do need some basic explanation and clarification of why they should treat others with decency.
2:59 AM
Because, to be clear - treating other people poorly is not good.
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and people who make tulpa largely already have that
2:59 AM
and a tulpa is not the same as a person, either
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Snuggle Squiggle 4/6/2018 3:00 AM
I don’t think that’s necessarily true.
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Reguile - a tulpa is as much of a person as the host is.
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Snuggle Squiggle 4/6/2018 3:00 AM
And that’s important when we’re talking about generalities.
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...that's essentially the point. In the end, there is not a heirarchy of which one is 'more of a person' than the other.
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the person is the thing with the identities
3:01 AM
what you call a host is also not a person
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I see.
3:01 AM
A difference in terminology, then.
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Snuggle Squiggle 4/6/2018 3:02 AM
(I should have had the foresight to create “time until meltingasphalt is linked” countdown or something.)
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In that case, what would you call the 'thing' that a tulpa/host is?
3:02 AM
And, what difference would you then draw between a 'person' and a 'human'?
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a tulpa, and what you call the host is probably best described as "original identity"
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Snuggle Squiggle 4/6/2018 3:02 AM
(or maybe there’s still time for a “days since meltingasphalt has been linked” count)
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...alright. So then, you have a person and the 'original identities' that exist in the brain of the person.
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the key point being that the functions of morality that effect people fail to function well when we are speaking of things that do not leave a person's brain
3:04 AM
a tulpa can be created and dissipated with no real harm or loss
3:04 AM
perhaps a person choosing to abuse their tulpa, might have a teensy little bit of a mental problem
3:04 AM
but the effects of dissipation are greatly overstated
3:05 AM
rather than being looked at as some murder or death, it should be looked at as what it is
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I believe you may be considering tulpas as made-up characters like imaginary friends, that people can pretend to become.
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a change in the way a person thinks.
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Otherwise, "dissipating" ends up being effectively impossible once a tulipa is capable of thinking autonomously.
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lots of people say that, but I do not think it is accurate. You can kick a habit like smoking, you can dissipate a tulpa, it just gets harder.
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In addition, morality should be considered seriously when it comes to interaction, as it results in a more positive relationship.
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when it comes to an individual
3:06 AM
making individiual choices
3:06 AM
morality is great and important
3:06 AM
when it comes to trying to caution others from acting freely, exploring, and considering, it is not such a case.
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People who are led into believing that a tulpa is just an identity that can be dissipated at will with no consequence (and, as you indicated by extention, that they can be dissipated by the tulpa at their will with no consequence) are being fed unwarranted fear - and additionally not advised in a way that will lead to a beneficial relationship between the host and any tulpas.
3:08 AM
After all, by that logic - why treat a tulpa postiively in the first place if it is just a 'way of thinking'?
3:08 AM
It is possible to abuse a tulpa - it is possible to keep them from interacting with others (after all, just as a host's interaction with a tulpa is not important in the same way as interaction with external individuals, the same holds true for the tulpa as they are the same type of 'thing').
3:09 AM
It is possible to treat them with disrespect.
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people who get so far into tulpa that they cannot dissipate them with significant efforts are well invested
3:09 AM
they didn't get to that point by mere accident
3:09 AM
the sort who comes in unthinking, without care, will likely never reach such a point
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That is no excuse for advising people in a way that does not discourage abuse.
3:10 AM
It is certainly possible to have a negative experience in making and interacting with a tulpa.
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you also say abuse, what do you expect the average person to do?
3:10 AM
remember, this is one person
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In addition, I did also point out - tulpas that can think autonomously (as in: On their own, without aid from the host) are effectively impossible to dissipate. That would indeed be "well invested".
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the tulpa isn't some abused little section of the mind, it's a means through which the person is thinking and acting
3:11 AM
it's better thought of as a series of mechanisms and systems you set in place that, while they can run as a habit or an assocation, are not like a fully separate thinking human being.
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Ah, to use your terminology, I don't expect the average person to do anything. I expect the average "original identity" to treat a tulpa based on how they learn what a tulpa is in the first place.
3:13 AM
As such, by teaching them that a tulpa is some autonomous pre-programmed mechanism that runs its course and isn't actually sapient at all - or by attempting to teach them that they, and their tulpas, are effectively just imagined identities without any independent agency at all, then you aren't actually teaching them what a tulpa is, and encouraging them to treat a tulpa that can be created in a way that would be considered abuse.
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holy fuck its skyewint
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Essentially, a lack of consideration of what the tulpa needs/desires.
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